S5 E37 | Recruiting Community: Indeed’s Ryan Batty and Steps to Push Forward The Issue of Pay Transparency

Ryan Batty, VP of Global Enterprise Marketing at Indeed, talks with Chris Hoyt about Ryan Reynolds, pay transparency, and how talent acquisition leaders are frontline when it comes to including salary information in job postings.

S5 E37 | Recruiting Community: Indeed’s Ryan Batty and Steps to Push Forward The Issue of Pay Transparency

Ryan Batty, VP of Global Enterprise Marketing at Indeed, talks with Chris Hoyt about Ryan Reynolds, pay transparency, and how talent acquisition leaders are frontline when it comes to including salary information in job postings.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 
I wish I could tell you I was exaggerating, but I 100% do have a little bit of a little bit of a man crush on Ryan Reynolds.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 0:06
Yeah, I do, too. And it’s been a long time going since 98 on that TV show on ABC called two guys, a girl in a pizza place. started early. Yeah, before that, but that was where I first saw him. And it’s I’ve been a fan since then. And I also think he has a great first name.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 0:23
Yeah, yeah. The first name is pretty great. It’s for sure. Yeah. It would. So two guys a girl. I totally forgot about that show. Yeah, I’m trying to think when did it Where did I not that I met Ryan rails. But where did I first meet Ryan Reynolds and

Ryan Batty, Indeed 0:40
I have Wilder was it. I’m trying to get his career arc.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 0:45
I think it was I think it was maybe it might have been Van Wilder than that. Yeah. And

Ryan Batty, Indeed 0:48
the biggest regret I have if you’re a fan of the Internet Movie Database, the best website in the world. I’m a movie buff. I’m not a sports buff. I’m a movie buff. There was a rumor for a long time that he they would re remake Fletch that originally started chevy chase in the 80s. And that Ryan Reynolds would be Fletch and I thought that would have been the most perfect casting ever. It didn’t happen. Jon Hamm got the roll. And it’s it’s out now.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 1:09
Definitely. Oh, I did. I didn’t know what I did see recently is Deadpool three. Bringing back Hugh Jackman as Wolverine. Yes. And that’s my other dude crush. Like, both of those guys are just the best.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 1:23
Well, I think Ryan Reynolds, Ryan Ryan Reynolds is a great recruiter. Look, he just gave Hugh Jackman a job. Right?

Chris Hoyt, CXR 1:29
Because that’s what do Jackman needs.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 1:32
What has he been doing this whole time? Not the Marvel Cinematic Universe, that’s for sure.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 1:36
Sitting around money. Yeah. That’s good. I do have a whole thing at aviator gin sitting in the cabinet in there. I have not opened yet. Because I’m not a big gin drinker. But I was like, I like Ryan Reynolds. Maybe I like his gin.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 1:48
Maybe I’ll like his chin and his cell phone service and his football team it’s football club in the UK and his his new creative ladders organization. Yes.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 1:56
Oh my god, the dudes on fire. Well, look, we’ll get started here. But we’re gonna circle back to Ryan Reynolds. For anybody who doesn’t know why we’re talking about I think we come back and talk to him. Are you ready to get this thing started?

Ryan Batty, Indeed 2:04
Let’s do it.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 2:05
All right, here we go. I get to hit the button.

CXR Announcer 2:08
Welcome to the CXR channel. Our premier podcast for Talent Acquisition and Talent Management. Listen in as the CXR community discusses a wide range of topics focused on attracting, engaging and retaining the best talent, we’re glad you’re here.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 2:38
Welcome back to the show, return watchers and listeners and hello to our first time, folks. I’m Chris Hoyt. I’m the president of CareerXroads. I’m the host of our recruiting community podcast. We’re here on the show, we actually invite leaders, practitioners personalities from talent acquisition space to actually talk about what’s hot in their worlds right now. And we do that in just about 20 minutes, over a cup of coffee, tea, sometimes a bottle of wine, we might have to do it with the aviator gin coming up soon. But the idea there’s no such luck on wine or gin today, but that is okay, because we do have a great topic around transparency, pay transparency, that should keep your attention. So if you are dialed in live with us today, please feel free to take advantage of the chat stream, you can ask questions, you can include your own comments as we go along, I will do my best to call those out and highlight your thoughts and your contribution. So for those of you who may not know, CXR is a community of just over 5000 recruiting professionals from around the world who work at organizations that hire an average of between 2000 and 200 thousand people a year each. Now here at CareerXroads we connect those members every single week in our forums, local dinners, we do online workshops, virtual roundtables, live meetings, leadership summits, etc. So for today’s conversation within that committee, I’m excited to welcome a first timer to the show. Ryan Batty who is the VP of marketing over at Indeed, Ryan, I’m gonna hit some buttons here. I’m gonna pull you in. Welcome to the show.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 4:08
Hey, Chris, thanks for having me. It’s really, really good to be here. Hey, everyone.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 4:13
So Ryan, from those who don’t know you, why don’t you give us sort of a quick escalator pitch on who is Ryan and why should we give a damn what Ryan has to say today?

Ryan Batty, Indeed 4:23
That’s a great question. I often ask that myself. So hi, everyone, I’m Ryan Batty. Hopefully, I’ve met at least some of you who are here today or who are watching the recording. I’ve been in this space for about 10 years. I joined Indeed, about one year ago. And I oversee marketing and Indeed for the work we do with larger companies with more complex hiring needs. So everyone who’s here today, you’re that size company that we’re working with and the my team thinks about every day. So it’s we call it enterprise marketing, but really, it’s about larger companies with more complex hiring needs. You have an ATS. You have a recruit thing, team, things like that. And we oversee a lot of the things that you might see emails, websites, the future works event coming up. And our engagements in multiple markets working with other teams. So it’s, it’s a real thrill for me to be in this space. I get to help people find jobs. And I’ve been doing it for about 10 years, and I can’t think of a better way to spend my time.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 5:23
Well, and Ryan, I think we met when you were when you were still at LinkedIn, years back right when the maybe during the whole LinkedIn events and you know, some of those talent connects.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 5:34
Absolutely. With multiple talent connects, and also different industry events. And just talking with your team at CareerXroads. Love what you do, and always have. And that’s not a plug, I think people here know that already. But it’s I think you’re focused on doing what’s right in this industry, and loved having you as part of those events there and see you there along with folks like Stacey and Google, Dave, and Larz and everyone else at the time.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 6:02
It is it is I know, this is not what we’re supposed to be talking about. But it is nice to see some of the events started making a comeback. I know we’ll talk a little bit about Indeed future works. But at the end here, but like, you know, HR tech just finished up and reported to have roughly 1000 People at it quite a bit different than last year. So we are returning to that hugging space that you know, the you know, getting into real live meetings again, and I think people are just excited,

Ryan Batty, Indeed 6:28
I hope so I as an extrovert, an Enneagram, type seven and all those things. It’s I get my energy out of being with people. I wish this was in person right now. I wish we were all together in a group. And I think and having a conversation like this in person, because that’s where I thrive. But I know other people thrive in different ways. And so what I think we’re moving to is a world where Sherm and HR tech, lead, HR exec, and others have to think about how you provide the type of experience your audience wants, whether it’s in person or virtual. But it is encouraging to see more people coming back, you know, I was at a very small, intimate leadership meeting with about 30. ta leaders, we could go. And it was interesting to hear that level. For very senior folks, they’re finding a lot of value either in going to very small, intimate workshops where they can collaborate in a space. Or if they’re perhaps sending their teams more to something like like Sherm, and in the HR tech draws a really interesting audience of senior people too. But the needs change and what people want to get out of it. And I’m, and what I’m also hearing is that they’re being much more judicious around where they spend their time, instead of doing maybe eight events three years ago, they might do three or four this year.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 7:41
Yeah. Well, I agree with you, Ryan. And I think we are gonna get on topic for anybody who’s dialed in, I promise. But you know, it’s funny, because with LinkedIn, Talent Connect, coming up, I’ll be there. It’s in Southern California, I’m going to be there. And I sent a note, we got about 130 hits of talent in our membership, and I sent a note and said, I’m gonna be there, you’re gonna be there, let’s grab a drink. Let me buy a nice thing of wine. It’d be good to see your face. And I think maybe two came back and said they’d be there and other four came back and said, I’m not going but someone else is going. And then almost everyone else who responded Ryan said, our budget got killed.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 8:15
Mm hmm.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 8:15
No travel, like the travel budget got killed. Not all the other budget necessarily, or at least yet, but the travel budget got killed. And it is an interesting sort of balance, because now we got people dying to get back. And the budgets again, locked up for fear of, you know, maybe what’s around the corner.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 8:30
That’s right. No, I’ve heard that myself. And I think that plus the fear of a spike in COVID in the fall, all the uncertainty in the economy. I’ve never seen so much change happened so fast, so big, as it’s happening right now. And I think I think companies are right to be cautious around their spend, but you know, as a marketer, and I understand TA and marketing, recruiting, marketing, HR and marketing, I often share that, that, I guess, common challenge that it’s our budgets and our travel budgets that often are looked at first in these situations. But I think ultimately, if companies like Indeed LinkedIn, Glassdoor Zip and others are providing something of value, not just a fun time that hopefully people will see that there’s some ROI and spending

Chris Hoyt, CXR 9:19
We’re not just signing up for a boondoggle

Ryan Batty, Indeed 9:21
Exactly, exactly. There’s there might be some boondoggle laying in there, but it’s not.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 9:26
It could be okay, so look, Ryan, let’s jump in. The topic we told everybody we were going to talk about and we eventually get through is pay transparency. And Indeed took a stance which which I am impressed with but indeed took a stance. And before we talk well, we’ll just jump right in the throwing salary ranges or pay ranges on job postings. And when we before we just jump into sort of the nuance piece of that, can you can you give us a little background on like, why? What I know it’s important we’re talking about pay transparency from here we’ve got legislature MANAP we’re seeing it in different states in some cities that are getting passed. But why did indeed sort of draw a line in the sand and say, Pick it pick a side?

Ryan Batty, Indeed 10:11
I think it’s important to like acknowledge the fact that the genies already out of the bottle here. It’s not necessarily that Indeed is forcing the issue. I think what we’re trying to do is, I know what we’re trying to do is make this change as as easy as possible for job seekers and for employers. What’s interesting about this, to me having been in this space for about 10 years is that this is actually not new. It feels to me like it’s more of a the pandemic and digital transformation and social injustice and all the things we’ve been through the past couple years that brought this like it’s forced us to really confront this for the first time, there’s been a lot of talk, there’s been some, some starts and stops around this, but I can see you know, Glassdoor, Indeed, LinkedIn, have all been in this space for a while and trying different methods for it. And none of them have been perfect for sure. And I think if you go back five years, six years, you saw this on Glassdoor, you saw this on LinkedIn, you saw elements of this on Indeed, but as a result of the last couple years, and what we see happening in legislation, not just in the US, but around the world is this is coming, this is happening. How do we help our job seekers and our customers deal with this in a way that’s like, acknowledge that change is hard. And this is hard, but also make sure that we’re doing what we’re doing the right way. That’s one way to look at it. And one way we look at it. Another is, is that Indeed, you know, as a marketplace, we we strive to serve well, both job seekers and employers. And sometimes as we know, in this space, that sometimes those needs aren’t aligned. I know I was raised not to talk about money. And I know as a hiring manager for years at multiple companies, you just didn’t talk about salary. It’s just not in our what some places

Chris Hoyt, CXR 11:59
It was against the rules. It was it was fireable offense.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 12:02
It was policy, right. And what we’re seeing now is whether it’s a company that has a a goal for transparency, or an ESG, or DE&I goal for pay equity, that they’re doing this of their own volition like you see with Starbucks, for example, or it’s because we see these changes coming just in California last week, right 200,000 employers in California, 13-15 million workers in the state, much less people who work for companies in this state, this is massive. And so some employers are telling us look, we don’t want to have a piecemeal patchwork of policies of state by state, we just need to like GDPR, we just need to address this thing like Microsoft is doing holistically, we’re going to make it a policy, Indeed made it a policy, we publish our pay rate pay on our on our jobs. So if you go look, we do it ourselves. Because we believe it’s the right thing. We’re not forcing our beliefs on our customers, we’re looking at job seekers want, we’re looking at where the market is going and where legislation is going and try to facilitate this the best way possible. And this is Ryan talking one of my favorite quotes, Churchill said, we can I gotta get this wrong, but it’s like, you can take change by the hand, or it will take you by the throat. What’s challenging, I think, right now is that every customer I talked to, and again, last week, I was with 30 or so very senior ta executives from DocuSign, T tech, Pepsi, Virgin brand Carmax us foods and others, and to a tee, every single one of them said this is the right thing to do. We believe in this, our company believes in this, but it’s hard. And

Chris Hoyt, CXR 13:39
There’s other issues, right? Like I’ll do devil’s advocate, because I do believe in what you’re doing. But I also believe that there can be a little bit of a challenge for some organizations, because we’ve got this issue of pay equity internally. And this this issue of compression, right and making things right, internally, I think Vizier, we had them on the show not too long ago talking about a boomerang report where people are leaving, right, and they’re coming back a series of months later for 20-25% pay increase. Because equity internally has just been so broken for so long, it’s so many organizations. Are you getting pushback, Ryan? Are you guys getting a little pushback from folks who are saying please don’t put these salaries out there because our employees are gonna see that we’re paying more for new talent than we are for the existing talent and shame on us. But I understand how it gets there.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 14:27
You know, what it is really it’s this is my observation is that the onus of pay equity is being put on the Talent Acquisition Professional, is that it is much more complex to address internally. It’s harder. I think there are a lot of great leaders and companies that I’ve seen and I tried to be myself is looking at my pay and comp ranges and going I gotta fix this. But really what’s happening is, Hey, everyone, we found a place, Indeed the industry, the world, right sound, the place where we can actually address pay equity and fair and equal pay for equal work. And it said At the acquisition point, it’s recruiting. And so it’s the recruiters who are now getting stuck with this helping, I don’t say stuck, it’s probably a, I think it’s actually a great opportunity. But oh, it’s hard. And they’re picking up the burden, not just for the people they’re trying to bring in, but also saying, there’s people who are leaving and coming back to play put to play that system, because we can’t fix it internally. So I do want to acknowledge that that is hard. And so customers I talked to do say, Yeah, this is difficult. Is there a different way to do it? We right now, this, we’re learning along with the market, and we’re trying to move as quickly as possible, and we think this is the best way to do it currently. But we are adapting with you for sure.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 15:38
Well, I mean, there are ripples, right? I talked to a leader yesterday, literally just yesterday, who said that they are taking that approach of doing the right thing. But then the comp leadership came back and said, in order to make this right across the board, so not just for new talent, but for existing talent, it’s gonna cost him 17 million. Now, I don’t know if that means the CEO is going to take a break from their you know, their comp or their extra bonuses, or how organizations are going to handle it. But it’s a very real number. And I think that’s just one of the ripples, right? Are you hearing the same thing that it’s that and then moves into other parts of the organization?

Ryan Batty, Indeed 16:14
I do. And I think it’s different for every company, $17 million, could make or break one company, it could be a rounding error to another,

Chris Hoyt, CXR 16:21
It would break my company.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 16:25
Throwing large numbers around. So what I know is that every company is different, every company has their own unique challenges, even the ones who are at the forefront of this. It’s hard. And this is what I’m going back to the folks I talked to or the what I see broadly in the industry and the medium and your guests that have been on here before, it’s just the right thing to do. And change is hard. And it could cost it has a cost. But here’s what I know universally, is that one we are competing for great talent to it is harder than ever to find talent. Even right now. It’s just under two open jobs. For every unemployed person in the US the new jolts report came out yesterday. It’s still competitive, even if it’s not quite as competitive. And what we’re looking for here is people to apply to our jobs. That’s what indeed is there to do. We’re here to make sure that if you have a job, we want to get you that right person right away as quickly as possible. And what we know is that on average, we see much more engagement, I could be ready, I could just throw stats at you all day long. But I think everyone here has heard him before, but it’s true, is that job seekers are far more likely to click on jobs that have salary transparency, or pay ranges on them. So it’s it’s truly what job seekers want. And you asked earlier about like, how do we kind of think about this, we put the job seeker at the front of our needs, that doesn’t mean we do it at the expense of employers. But if you want job seekers looking at your jobs, that’s what you can do. Indeed, that’s why we put jobs on Indeed, this is what they want. This is the number one thing they asked for, when they look at a job. And they’re assessing whether it’s right or wrong. That doesn’t mean putting the exact salary on there. But a pay range is going to create much more traffic for jobs and much more, even more applies, which is really what we’re trying to get.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 18:11
Yeah. And I think I think we had, there was a stat shared a little bit earlier, I think you guys say that you’re seeing roughly a 30% increase in activity on the job or combination of act like whatever, whatever is defined as engagement, but 30% more engagement on jobs than have that up front, right?

Ryan Batty, Indeed 18:26

Chris Hoyt, CXR 18:27
nI will tell you right, so I’ll just tell you. So we’re doing a little bit of research on our end with our members. So we have 130 companies and brands in the membership. We went with the fortune 300, where we’re just doing a little bit of homework. And as we’re going through, we took some people through our members jobs and preliminary feedback that we’re getting, where we say, well, what could you know, Nike? Or what could GE or Disney or any of these other members? What could they have done differently in the post? And some early comments coming back from the people doing the homework is that man, I wish they would have just put the job salary or wage up front? Yeah, I don’t make me dig for it. When it was there. It wasn’t typically up front on the posting, right? It would have been easier to find. So they’re looking for it if it’s not there.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 19:10
That’s true. And this is what’s so hard about too because what’s one of the number one frustrations we hear from folks in talent acquisition is is is ghosting, right? Or getting getting down the recruitment funnel to a point where they drop on you. And usually often it’s because the pay wasn’t clear. Right? So there’s this like this, this tough spot we’re in where this is so important for jobseekers. 98% of them say it’s it’s helpful in their job search and 75% are more likely to apply on Indeed 75% are more likely to apply. That’s what we want. And they’re going to apply because they have some understanding of what the pay range is. And that’s going to cut back on ghosting but also make them more engaged and make you more confident that the person you’re talking to actually wants to work there. It’s hard.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 19:55
So 75 is a big number and should should not be bawked at. It’s a serious note. But right from an application standpoint, and especially the time when folks are kind of struggling to get the talent in there. That’s right. But I’m gonna, I’m gonna play devil’s advocate again, right, I’m gonna say I am, I’m in a very competitive market, my organization is not in favor, whether I am or not as the team leader, my organization is not in favor of putting jobs, putting the salaries on our jobs. And these, these bands of salary are popping up on Indeed, and my candidates are asking me about them. And they’re not a match to what we actually pay. They’re either anymore or they’re less. What What can I do? What do I do? Is there a hotline is there because the bands aren’t coming off? Right, that the wages are staying on? What what do I do as a TA leader?

Ryan Batty, Indeed 20:41
Right, right. And as as what’s interesting here, to establish kind of the foundation of this is that almost two thirds of jobs on Indeed today have pay ranges on them. And about a third of those 34%, I just looked at the stat recently, our employer provided. So let’s say roughly a third of jobs on Indeed today have employer provided pay ranges or direct pay on the job. So there are a lot of folks doing this. And in fact, probably almost three quarters of those that are posted by employers. So 33-34% by employers, about two thirds of those are coming have paid I’m trying to remember the have the actual pay ranges on and I’ll get back on the stat. What I’m trying to say here is that this is actually happening a lot today, I think what’s happening is as we move up into larger companies, right, some of this audience here, it’s a little more challenging, because we’re in multiple markets, we have unions, and some not in others, we’re in many states. And so what we do is about another third of those jobs. So if say 60-65% of jobs on Indeed today have pay ranges, roughly half of those are coming from employers, the other half is coming from indeed, we publish what we believe is the most reliable salary data pay data, you know, in a range broad enough to help allow some flexibility for the employer, but also that job seeker to understand realistically what they can make. So we have an estimation engine, we update it weekly. And that’s pulling from ATS isn’t if there’s not a if there’s not a pay range or exact pay posted on that job and your ATS. If we have enough data to provide a reliable estimate to job seekers, we will do that. That doesn’t mean it’s perfect, right? That means that it’s a range. And what we want to do is make it easy as heck, for employers to go in and change it themselves either in their ATS or come on and post the job on Indeed, and do it directly. And over time, we’re listening and we’re evolving this is that we want to easy for anyone to come in and change it directly on indeed whether it’s indexed or hosted. Now. So the important point here is what can I do is go into your ATS, and you can update and provide a range that you want to see on that job. It can be whatever range you want, and we will put it there, we’re not mandating a specific range, we’re just want to make sure our job seekers can get some estimation of what they think they could make, which also means far more applies to your jobs.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 23:03
It is a little bit and I’m not saying this is a bad thing. But it is a little bit of a strong arm that says if you’re not putting in the range, at least we’re going to fill in the blank with our estimate. And if you want that to go away, you want our estimate to go away whether it’s too high or too low, then put your own range in there. And I do think to your point earlier, like this change is hard. I admire I do admire that approach of forcing that hand because it is coming, right. I mean, next year, we have a leadership meeting out in Chicago. Yay, Live Meeting. We have a leadership meeting out in Chicago, where we’ve got about 40 of the heads of talent coming in, and we’re doing a panel on pay transparency. And I gotta tell you, some of them, they’re a little worried because California, right? It’s right around the corner in New York City, Colorado, like you’ve got these places that are saying we’re tired of, you know, jerking around on this topic. It’s time to start talking about pay equity across the board, because it has a huge impact throughout the organization.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 23:57
Yes, it does. And I think you know, if it feels like strong arming, that is absolutely not the intent. We do believe that this is the right thing to do. From from a standpoint of helping you get the right applicants for your jobs. It’s truly truly what we want. And we see it in the numbers. We’re also acknowledging the fact that the dominoes are falling faster and faster here and how do we help them make it easier for for folks to do this in a way where can you actually get to every job right and put all the papers on the job?

Chris Hoyt, CXR 24:27
Well, who released the stat So Gerry, you know, Gerry Crispin, my business partner, Jerry mentioned the stat every once in a while because he just it blows his mind, and it’s really upsetting. But there was an organization that came out and said, we will we will reach 100% pay equity for women in 71 years.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 24:44
Yeah, yep.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 24:45
Why? Why does it why would it take 71 year is that that’s them just doing it on their own, versus everybody sort of leaning in and to your point, the momentum of the laws that are changing and and the stances

Ryan Batty, Indeed 24:57
That’s that’s absolutely right. And in fact, 71 years isn’t improved. We’re where we were before the pandemic, when honestly was something like 120 years, based on how things were being done. If we keep going at the current rate, this is how long it will take. Women in general make 82 cents on the dollar to men in the US. I’m the father of two young daughters. I don’t like that. I want it. So yeah, I have a personal interest in this. But that’s not what, you know, there’s more to it than that. But I believe that we all have an obligation to, to help equal pay for equal work, right. And 82 cents on the dollar is not enough for someone who works just as hard. It’s just as smart, smarter in the case of my wife versus me. But honestly, like, this is a problem we can solve. I think what’s so hard is that here it is, this change is coming. And we’re seeing it all around us. And I think this group, the talent acquisition teams, and HR teams, are the ones that are getting faced with having to implement it and deal with the difficult conversations that companies need to have internally, around doing what is right, right. We’ve talked about this for a long time. Now I’m talking now kind of more philosophically about the business world here. We’ve talked about it for a long time, we’ve observed how long it will take, we’re hoping other people will make things happen. legislations driving it social injustice, and certain companies that believe this is the right thing to do like Microsoft, for example, are making this happen. But it it’s hard. And let’s just see knowledge that everyone’s putting most of the burden on this group to make this thing happen.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 26:22
Because this fear, right? Yeah, they feel they feel that pain out front. Exactly. Yep. All right, right, I want to talk about we’re kind of, we’re kind of time I want to I do have something I want you to talk about here at the end, because I think people are gonna be really interested in it. But before we sort of shift topics, and if you’ve ever watched the show, or you listen to the show, you know, we asked this of all of our guests, if you were going to write a book, Ryan, on the state of this topic, what would the title, what would the title of your book be?

Ryan Batty, Indeed 26:51
I will, I would, I would definitely dedicate it to my daughters. There’s something I think about some of the historical nonfiction books that have been written about people who took a took a gamble or took a bet on something or did the unpopular thing that ended up being right in the end. And this is no, this is not good. And I did not think about this before, but it’s okay. That’s why we ask, it is looking back and saying like, a week. This is so cheesy. It was on us. It was on us and maybe. But maybe that’s more of a subtitle than a title, which is it’s like breaking through or something like that. I don’t want to sound like a motivational book is this is a hard time. But let’s let’s admit right now, we are climbing a very, very steep mountain and climbing a mountain. It’s tough. And we’re all looking at each other and running out of food. But what we need to focus on is what it’s going to look like when the top of that mountain. And for better for worse. This is the group that has the opportunity and some responsibility to help make that happen. And that’s tough, because some of us didn’t sign up for it. But gosh, what an awesome opportunity to do this. And to change and speed up 70 years to seven or seven months or next week.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 28:09
Won’t that be grand? Yeah, I fucking love it. I love it. Ryan, I love I love that piece. And I guess so the follow up question. And it’s always the same. I think I already know the answer to this, who gets the first signed copy of your book?

Ryan Batty, Indeed 28:21
Oh, my wife. I’ve watched her for 20 years, do this and fight this. And she’s always knew the power of negotiation. She’s taught me a lot in this area as well. So I’d probably be my wife. And then after that my uncle’s my two uncles Less and Jim, who both had careers in HR. And literally as I was a kid, I’m not kidding. I said, I should probably have a career in HR. They were Southland Corporation, US Airways true value, senior HR leaders, and I watched how they got to work with people help people find jobs, help people get paid. No, no Joe, and the humor. I admired that about them too. But they really were helping people. And I believe that as a kid, and it’s what’s brought back some of this passion for me in the last 10 years since I’ve been in this space. So I would say my uncle last and Uncle Jim would get the next two copies.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 29:09
I love that. That’s fantastic. All right, Ryan, you’ve got you got an event coming up. I don’t want to talk a little bit about let me see if I can throw it up on the screen here. There we go. This is this is where if we had the digital rights to the music, I would cue the Whitney Houston and I will always love you song. Being a little bit of a Ryan Reynolds fan, but talk to us a little bit what’s going on with this Future Works 2022

Ryan Batty, Indeed 29:35
Sure. Well, we’re acknowledging the fact that the future of work has changed. Let’s be honest. And issues like this diversity, equity inclusion have fundamentally changed the nature of how we employ people how we hire. And so we’re taking a new twist on undines customer conference and we’re calling it Future Works. So it is about the future of work and how the world will work. Better Work for folks. It’s also about the future of your work. Like we are very much focused On the Talent Acquisition Professional, and what does it mean to be a TA professional, especially for larger companies in this day and age, so issues like what we’re talking about today are going to come up. But we’re also putting together a pretty cool slate of speakers to talk about this. And one of them is yes, Ryan Reynolds, who we announced on Monday is going to be one of our keynote speakers. And not just because he is a smart, funny witty entertainer and an entrepreneur, but he also has something called Careerladders.org, which I encourage you to look out for he is investing heavily as a co founder in career ladders, which helps people underserved communities get access to creative jobs and creative careers, and lifting up entrepreneurs in that space, and particularly people of color. So he has a really interesting view on some of the things we’re thinking about today. And the TA space and also is going to be the second best looking Ryan. At Future Works. Sorry, I just had to plug that.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 30:55
Oh, yeah, I see what you did there. Yeah. Well, when you think that guy couldn’t get any cooler?

Ryan Batty, Indeed 30:59
I know. Yes. And we’re super excited with isa Ray, we have others too. It’s going to be a great session. So both virtually. And next week in New York City, October 12, and 13th in the major works.com. If you want to find out more

Chris Hoyt, CXR 31:14
Good stuff, man. I’ll be I will be out or I wouldn’t be there to be super excited. But yeah, you’ll have to let us know have to let us know how that goes across. All right, Ryan, I’m going to put you in the green room. So I can do a little song and dance about what’s coming up. And what’s ahead for the rest of the folks hanging out. Please don’t go anywhere.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 31:31
Alright, thanks. Thanks, everyone.

Chris Hoyt, CXR 31:33
All right. Thank you so much. We appreciate you being on Ryan.

Ryan Batty, Indeed 31:35

Chris Hoyt, CXR 31:37
All right, really quickly, I’m gonna see if I can do a screen share with you guys. We’ll just pop it up. You don’t see me on there. But on there all day. Here you go. So we got leadership media coming up October 10. For six or you can find all of these by the way at CXR.works/events. That leadership meetings take place in Chicago. We’re excited about that. We have a podcast show coming up with some some really interesting ta leaders who have come out of enterprise sized organizations to go run ta at some startups find out what they said when I asked if they’d ever go back. In addition to that, we do our monthly lecture series coming up October 18. We’re talking about evolution of recruiting sorry, on the podcaster we’ve got evolution of recruiting with Mark Gray, we’ve got a solution spotlight on October 19th. Coming up on Paradox, we have a workshop with Kat Kebun. She has been on the show a number of times she’s done a workshop with us before you’re gonna love it. And then back to the lecture where I jumped the gun a little bit apologize. We’ve got keys to optimizing your mind we do those monthly if you’re not already aware, you can find those and the future sessions at CXR.works/lecture and then we’re into November but that’s Roy. We’ll come back to Roy we can talk about him later. And we’ll take that off. One man show with all the logistics. I want to thank everybody for being out here. dialing in and listening and we will see you next week.

CXR Announcer 33:02
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